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Lot of people say wanderer can't play support, is it true?

Discussion in 'Wonderer' started by Tankno, Dec 28, 2016.

  1. .VincentValentine.

    .VincentValentine. New Member

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    Class:
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    ShuShu
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    You guys forget that undine also has a heal skills for a rod where you sit down and play a harp. Its another heal skill besides the standard barb one and if I remember correctly it's based on int. So a geo/painter/undine is a great support. I've personally played it and prefered using the undine then bard but. U could take undine heal skill, Tornado or sleep for geo, Bard heal, and final painter since they have men skills.
     
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  2. Oceanmk

    Oceanmk Jumping around..

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    Yeah true, undine do have a great int heal for support. And that Rod route I also consider taking it. But thinking of the additional rebirth advantage of spiker critical passive, i still feel spear is a nicer choice. But still, I will try it out and may take this route.

    Thinking of 1h spear + shield as support and still able to use magical based skills and undine heal (rebirthed) with an anti-sleep branch (Men stat naturally anti-sleep, this skill enhance it).

    But still a reason amount of damage is still prefered as a support, 2h spear is still my likely choice.

    Try all and pick one most suitable I guess.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2016
  3. curse2themax

    curse2themax New Member

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    Wait MEN stat is naturally sleep resist?As in, even Raid Boss Clown resist? All classes? I thought it was crazy my MON STR=MEN survives a lot of sleep spells
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2016
  4. Oceanmk

    Oceanmk Jumping around..

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    Yea I got the info from a Japan wiki site. Vit is natural stun resistance but increase chance of sleep effect on you. Men is natural sleep resistance but increase chance of stun effect on you. Lol so Men > Vit is countering each other haha.. So undine heal skill (sleep resistance branch should be able to offset the vit natural sleep weakness)

    Edit: There's the link..
    http://wikiwiki.jp/avabel/?%A5%B9%A5%C6%A1%BC%A5%BF%A5%B9
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2016
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  5. Taibasa Tsuyou

    Taibasa Tsuyou Otaku Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Ohh...wauw..... No wonder I get stunned a lot on F13 and F14.... o.o"

    I should sometimes read through that site too... had it saved, but havent used that one a lot xD
     
  6. Oceanmk

    Oceanmk Jumping around..

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    That jp avabel site never update new info already but still good. Lol same as avabel hk need translation.
     
  7. Taibasa Tsuyou

    Taibasa Tsuyou Otaku Member Staff Member Moderator

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    You mean AppBank or the link you put there earlier? Since I did see Revenger with Nightmare and Vampire in the link x'D
    But true that AppBank hasn't any updates now (Murai and the others also kind of quit Avabel videos, as well as that their NPCs were gone since some time ago).
    (Murai and Mamiruton were heavily influenced with the Avabel AppBank site).

    EDIT: Sorry for a little off-Topic. Ö'
     
  8. Oceanmk

    Oceanmk Jumping around..

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    Yeah I mean the link. But seems I'm the one outdated xD The link do update haha.. Last check it never update info on hermit hidden lol.
     
  9. $wagberg

    $wagberg New Member

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    Wanderers can play a support role thanks to the Bard class and it's skills that can heal allies around it as well as the normal class itself for the bonfire skill that can increase HPR and SPR (better using the sit emotion after placing it) and the Mind Sphere that can restore allies sp with a sacrifice of your own.
     
  10. Ace144

    Ace144 New Member

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    Alright. Now that I have played some of the Wanderer class, I feel I can properly talk about this topic.

    In my opinion, the Wanderer class isn't meant to be a support class. It does have some supporting skills, but it isn't a lot compared to the actual support classes.

    I feel Wanderer is more of a floor grinding support class. Its attacks specialize in AoEs, so it can kill mobs faster than most other classes. It has the campfire to help people take a rest when they need to recover SP (or HP). It does have healing, but it is much weaker compared to Creators and Acolytes. It can't really be relied on. (Though free healing is free... even if it isn't as big as the competition.) The SP ball recovers SP once, and the cooldown time is absurdly long. It isn't really enough to rely on either.

    To me, the Wanderer class is a utility class.

    Next is how I feel the Wanderer class is like.

    I feel the Wanderer class is a class that wanders the floors and helps players along the way. It can help with fight through the hordes. It can sing them a song to help them feel better. It can make a campfire to help players recover faster. Outside of that, it fights by itself.
     
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  11. Taibasa Tsuyou

    Taibasa Tsuyou Otaku Member Staff Member Moderator

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    Why recommending sit? I'd definitely recommend lying on the ground, since it'll recover more than sitting can. :3

    But you're saying it yourself...It can help along the way.... This implies that it IS possible to do support. xD
    You're saying that it can heal others but cannot be relied on. True, it doesn't last long enough for one to stay alive long, but at least it's really helpfull better than nothing at all. This again hints to a support.

    Remember that the original topic isn't about what the best support is but on whether Wanderer can play support or not.
    Wanderer has enough support-skills to be called a "Support".

    Like if you compare Wanderer to a Magician. Wanderer would definitely be seen as a Support, given the fact that it can help other Players, in terms of Healing, HP/SP Regen and other buffs/debuffs. Magician at the other hand mostly only have damaging AoE skills, which doesn't have any healing skills, nor HP/SP Regen, with a few buff/debuffs (like Slowing enemy down from Black Corrupter, or few knocking back skills).

    All in all, it depends on each Build, because that can change a lot in going to be a Supportive-attacker ( (Healing+Buff+Debuff) > Attacking ) or Attacking-supporter ( (Healing+Buff+Debuff) < Attacking ).
    Nevertheless, this woon't change the fact that Wanderer CAN do some support, effective or not.
     
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  12. Ace144

    Ace144 New Member

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    Wanderer has one buff in its entire set. It's the campfire. I've already explained that its use is really limited to floor grinding. The rest are selfish.

    Wanderer has one debuff. It is the movement speed penalty from Battle Dancer. This debuff is shared between Creator, Rogue, and Mage... with Creator getting three attacks that do this debuff.

    Wanderer can recover SP. I can't really argue this one. Though I will say the cooldown is too long to really be relied on. There is a reason people can overcharge for SP pots in the stall.

    Wanderer has one status aliment... sleep. It is the only class with the ability to effectively stop enemy movement without it being random or having a downside. The only argument I can come up with is someone putting sleep Orbs on their gear, but nobody does that. I can't really say much.

    Wanderer has two heals. This is the only real thing that can possibly put this class in the support category. The reason why I'm against saying it can play support is because healing is something two other classes can do better. If the other classes are around (which they are for harder content), you have very little reason to pop a heal when they have it covered. Even if they are by themselves, the target would still have to use pots to supplement the remaining hp that wasn't healed. (Once again, I am assuming content that would require healing support.) (If a mage got healing, would it be support?)

    The person who wrote this was clearly looking for a class that could support well. After a few explanations, he found that it's support was very limited. While it can play support, it isn't very good support. It's specialty is AoE damage. Support is a minor second. (I guess my point is that its support is a little too weak to be relied on. There's little reason for Wanderers to play support when its support is this limited.)
     
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  13. Taibasa Tsuyou

    Taibasa Tsuyou Otaku Member Staff Member Moderator

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    I think it just depends on each individual and each individual's Build for the Character then..
    I personally don't see any problems in the low heals, since heals are always welcome :3
    True that the heals are the lowest out of Acolyte, Creator and Wanderer, but it still heals some. ^^ I've always appeaciated the heals from Wanderer's Bard as a Mage als still do~
    Yet, support isn't all about heals only.

    Most convient answer on OP would still be its own opinion and feeling :p
    (just attacking is actually already supporting others, it's just the healing, buffs, debuffs and other things that makes a class "more" supportive or not).
    In this case Wanderer would still be at the 3rd place of being a Support, which I admit do have a huge gap with the two classes above (I do think that Acolyte and Creator share the same place though).
     
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  14. Ace144

    Ace144 New Member

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    I agree. In some cases, I felt like I could help some people by hitting harder than just providing "back-up." In the other post, he mentioned wanting to be useful. I challenged it, but it seemed it was ignored. I guess he really wanted to be considered support.

    As I am thinking, I think this game has evolved from "needing" a support class. A lot of content can be solo'd with good gear and some pots. Theoretically speaking, it is possible to take down really hard content by taking a squad of just damage dealers. The goal would be to kill the enemy before it can kill you.

    Debuffs are now being shared between classes. As I mentioned before, the movement speed debuff is spread across four classes. Defense down is between three. Creator isn't the only class with debuffs anymore. (Heck, Acolyte has a debuff that Creators don't even get.)

    Everyone should play the class they like to play. Every class has a way it can help out. Everyone has their own part to play. Everyone is important. (I don't believe DPS is expendable.)
     
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  15. .VincentValentine.

    .VincentValentine. New Member

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    Now saying it's the best or anything but I prefer a build of 35 men rest dex for dex scales with both str and int while crits every second. Why do this u say is because I feel that this class already has a high hp count considering the passive raising hp up and armor. Any dmg I take just pop a bard heal or undine harp. Damage for this build can be either phy or magic due to dex scale and wrap which I recommend a 1h spear for it scales both matk and patk. 9* is the way to go for you can find one for as low as 6 mil. This spear also allows u to use basically all skills except undine(unless rebirth). I feel support wise this is a good way to go since you have men and crits to go with it! So just what I recommend.
     
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  16. Oceanmk

    Oceanmk Jumping around..

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    Nice idea, when I got enough free gems from daily log in I'll restat give it a try. I love using 1h spear ^^ and agree 1h spear indeed very cheap in stall. Got a 7* for 1million (lucky) and average is 3 million in stall for one (level 70).
     
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  17. .VincentValentine.

    .VincentValentine. New Member

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    No problem I'm just trying to make support for a class that people believe is the worse into a decent support when used right or smartly! And indeed due to everyone craving dmg they often over look pricing. A 1h with a higher * and lower price beats a low * 2h at a higher price for me. I wish this info to be used just by more people so we can start having more styles to fight against when we enter PvP for all I find is the typical cookie cutter str builds time and time again.(not saying it's wrong for it is effective but let avabel have people play fun crazy special builds like the old days!)
     
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